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agilebritSomething Jane Espenson said at WriterCon triggered this.
She pointed out that making Willow bisexual after Tara died would have been interesting, adding another layer to her character. At the same time, it would have also vindicated some audience members who were *cough* less than supportive of her lifestyle choice, in that, had she gone back to a man, the relationship with Tara could have been dismissed as a "mistake." That was something the writers didn't want to do to that character, so they didn't go into it.
Here's a polarizing character for you: Riley Finn. Millions of fans of BtVS hate Riley with the fire of a thousand suns. They want him to die a horrible, slow death. I'm not one of them. I thought he was a decent, kind, nice guy...who got in a little over his head.
I did not want to make him a bad guy in this fic in progress. I don't like character-bashing fics, because usually the character being bashed is so out of character as to be unrecognizable. Riley was not an abuser, was not a rapist, was not a bastard. Turning him into one for the purposes of bashing the character does a disservice not only to him, but to Buffy as well--because why on earth would this strong, beautiful, smart woman even be attracted to someone who treated her like that (Spike notwithstanding; she was at a far different place mentally and psychologically in Season 6 than she was in Seasons 4&5)? And why would all the other characters like him as well?
That being said...[spoiler alert! I'll do this in white font so people who don't want to know can be surprised, hoping fervently that the background colors for other people's LJ's will still keep it hidden]I've vamped Riley.[/spoiler] I've taken a canonical situation, something we know he did, and tweaked the circumstances. And that raises what I now call "the Willow dilemma." People who hate Riley are going to feel vindicated by this fic. They're going to be happy that yet another author has turned him into a bad guy--even though my purpose in this fic was not to do that at all, but rather to explore reactions to situations that are emotionally upsetting, and the bad choices that people can make under stress.
But the fact that it's Riley doing this raises a dilemma for me as the author. I don't want him to be a bad guy...and yet I've made him one. And I'm afraid that the audience that's inclined to dislike him is going to take this the entirely wrong way.
And that also points up the question of whether we write this stuff for ourselves, or for an audience. Personally, I think that anyone who doesn't think they write for an audience is fooling themselves. Of course we want to be read. We have something to say, a story to tell, and we want people to pay attention to us. Otherwise this stuff would just sit on our hard drives at home and never be posted on the internet for people to read. Otherwise we wouldn't get our feelings hurt when people flame us--or, conversely, when we don't get reviews at all.
There's nothing wrong with that. But there's a balance we strike in writing to an audience, and writing for ourselves. I'm still going to tell the story I want to tell, here--don't get me wrong.
But it bothers me that people are going to use it as a further excuse to dislike Riley.
She pointed out that making Willow bisexual after Tara died would have been interesting, adding another layer to her character. At the same time, it would have also vindicated some audience members who were *cough* less than supportive of her lifestyle choice, in that, had she gone back to a man, the relationship with Tara could have been dismissed as a "mistake." That was something the writers didn't want to do to that character, so they didn't go into it.
Here's a polarizing character for you: Riley Finn. Millions of fans of BtVS hate Riley with the fire of a thousand suns. They want him to die a horrible, slow death. I'm not one of them. I thought he was a decent, kind, nice guy...who got in a little over his head.
I did not want to make him a bad guy in this fic in progress. I don't like character-bashing fics, because usually the character being bashed is so out of character as to be unrecognizable. Riley was not an abuser, was not a rapist, was not a bastard. Turning him into one for the purposes of bashing the character does a disservice not only to him, but to Buffy as well--because why on earth would this strong, beautiful, smart woman even be attracted to someone who treated her like that (Spike notwithstanding; she was at a far different place mentally and psychologically in Season 6 than she was in Seasons 4&5)? And why would all the other characters like him as well?
That being said...[spoiler alert! I'll do this in white font so people who don't want to know can be surprised, hoping fervently that the background colors for other people's LJ's will still keep it hidden]I've vamped Riley.[/spoiler] I've taken a canonical situation, something we know he did, and tweaked the circumstances. And that raises what I now call "the Willow dilemma." People who hate Riley are going to feel vindicated by this fic. They're going to be happy that yet another author has turned him into a bad guy--even though my purpose in this fic was not to do that at all, but rather to explore reactions to situations that are emotionally upsetting, and the bad choices that people can make under stress.
But the fact that it's Riley doing this raises a dilemma for me as the author. I don't want him to be a bad guy...and yet I've made him one. And I'm afraid that the audience that's inclined to dislike him is going to take this the entirely wrong way.
And that also points up the question of whether we write this stuff for ourselves, or for an audience. Personally, I think that anyone who doesn't think they write for an audience is fooling themselves. Of course we want to be read. We have something to say, a story to tell, and we want people to pay attention to us. Otherwise this stuff would just sit on our hard drives at home and never be posted on the internet for people to read. Otherwise we wouldn't get our feelings hurt when people flame us--or, conversely, when we don't get reviews at all.
There's nothing wrong with that. But there's a balance we strike in writing to an audience, and writing for ourselves. I'm still going to tell the story I want to tell, here--don't get me wrong.
But it bothers me that people are going to use it as a further excuse to dislike Riley.
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*smooches and cuddles agilebrit*
Date: 2004-08-05 06:53 pm (UTC)A way you might handle this situation is to emphasize the effect his vamping has on those who *do* like him--the Scoobies. Emphasize how painful it would be for them to find out someone they care for has been vamped. No one could accuse you of Riley hatred then.
Re: *smooches and cuddles agilebrit*
Date: 2004-08-05 07:20 pm (UTC)Glad you made it home okay. :-)
Oooh! What a good idea! Of course...Buffy's going to have to kill him. Because no way am I going to have Spike "rescuing" her. She's the Slayer, dammit; she doesn't need rescuing from a fledgling vamp--even if he is her former boyfriend and there's an emotional connection there.
I'm not really concerned about being accused of Riley hatred, so much as giving the Riley-haters more fuel for their fire. Heh. I don't think anyone in either camp is going to be happy with me by the end of this fic. What was it someone said? "Entertainment gives us what we want; art gives us what we didn't know we wanted."
Not that I'm pretentious enough to call what I'm doing "art." LOL
no subject
Date: 2004-08-06 12:27 am (UTC)I think it sounds like a great story idea
no subject
Date: 2004-08-06 02:34 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-08-06 02:38 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-08-06 12:39 am (UTC)Just b/c it happened on the show all the time - (and forgive me for not having read the fic in question - been busy trying to type up a 9-part monster of m'own) - however, don't wade through the 'Spike syndrome' with Riley in this either (won't use the spoiler-y stuff) - I like the idea of what you're doing, but just as long as the Scooby gang doesn't get into 'excusing' Riley's 'situation' *because* it's Riley - like they did with Oz and Tara. IE: it's okay that they're demons b/c they're our friends too, but Spike can go screw himself b/c he wasn't our friend and we don't want him to be. (so that's the 7th grade way of putting it, but that's what happened)
and I'll leave it at that before I write an essay in your comments ;)
no subject
Date: 2004-08-06 12:41 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-08-06 02:32 am (UTC)And you haven't read the fic in question because it's not posted anywhere yet. :-) I like to finish them before I post them, no matter how many parts there are. I haven't even broken it up into chapters yet; it just keeps on a-comin'.
I think the Scooby attitude toward Spike is going to change significantly in this fic as well. They generally took their cues from Buffy, and as long as she treated him like a thing, they did too. For this...she won't be doing that. I think that if circumstances had been a bit different, she might have seen him in a different light, so I'm exploring that. 'Cause, Bitch!Buffy? Not my favorite character. She's not going to be all sweetness and light, but she will at least respect his effort. Especially since [spoiler]the chip doesn't work anymore--and he's being good.[/spoiler] So, hopefully I'll be able to keep them in character and still be able to examine these issues.
One thing I learned at WriterCon was that, if the characters have to be out of character for your plot to work...then your plot doesn't work. I may need to find a beta who'll stomp on me if it gets too OOC, but so far I think it's okay.
no subject
Date: 2004-08-06 08:04 pm (UTC)shows you how 'in tune' with the fic world *I* am -- don't read so much anymore -- mostly writing -
and totally get where you're going with this -- liking the idea too -
*raises hand as potential stompy beta* I can be that - if you need - beta I can do -
and this: if the characters have to be out of character for your plot to work...then your plot doesn't work.
Hell yeah - so true - on board there. And, alas, herein lies the problem with many a fic ---
me go back to the world of Van Helsing now - ;)
no subject
Date: 2004-08-06 02:35 am (UTC)And about your Riley question, as long as you show Riley being a bastard *because* of the vamping, I don't think it's bad. And Buffy and the Scoobies should be reasonably torn-up and not all "yay! Now we get to stake him!"